I am about to decide

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Offline Manal

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I am about to decide
« on: September 24, 2007, 02:55:25 AM »
Hi everyone

This post will be quiet long, so bare with me cause many events had occured to me the last couple of days.
Two days ago, my cousin ( who recently knew my son had thal) advised me to pay a visit to a newly opened center that offer natural, non invasive medical therapy in different fields (ozone therapy- biomolecular therapy- neurostimulation- skin therapy using sea weeds+laser+ozone-)

The owner of this center is his friend who had a horrible five years expierence with his daughter. She had a brain cancer when she was 10 years and after horrible stories they had succeded in conquering cancer but the little girl who is now 16 years old was left blind as the chemo had affected deeply the nerve of the eyes. Anyway, he was inroduced to an Egyptian doctor who studied and lived all his life in Germany and he treated her with biomolecular therapy for one year and now this girl can see once more but no more than 6 meters till this point. I met the girl today and yes she can see. Her father said that as long as the nucleus of the cells is still alive, the biomolecular therapy can regenerate new cells and that what happened to the nerve of the eye.

When I sat with this doctor, he is now between Germany and Egypt, i told him about my son's case and to my surprise he told me that he made researches on thalassemia for seven years when he worked at Bahrain for a while as most couples are relatives and thal is widely spread there.  /he had many cases that were treated by biomolecular therapy and the people who had the cost and the patience to continue the course began to make their own blood.

This treatment is offered by:
http://www.vitorgan.com/page_i.htm  and this doctor work as a researcher for this company for 12 years. He told me that the treatment is made up of components of the cells taken from an ox without the nucleus of these cells. According to the company, the ox is the most suitable in its cell components compared to humans. This is what we call Live cells, hope you have idea about.

According to the doctor, Beta thal patients don't have problem in ALL the process of hb formation but only in step number 4. He said that there are 7 steps that happen in the bone marrow before the formation of the stem cell itself to form blood , the beta patients has a problem in step 4 only regardless the kind of mutation as long as it is a beta and nothing else. The treatment will do two things:
First: he told me for simplicity assume that you need a,b,c,d to form Hb, your son has a and c for example that are muted so the medicine will give him ready made a and c and the body is going to use or combine them to form healthy blood

Second:While doing this process the body will change its muted programming in this step so that when the medicne stops the body will continue to program in a correct way. When i asked him howcome and this is a genetic disorder and in this case why then we need gene therapy, he added that again it is not the original cell itself that is muted in beta, but it is one of the  steps in the process of forming HB and gene therapy is still needed in other felds

When i asked him about the side effect he said none and when i told him that everything has its own risk. He said that when you exceed the dose , comes the side effect and he added that when i eat, nothing happens to me but if i eat the same food in large quantities, my stomach will hurt.

The treatment takes one year, 3 heavy months where you are injected day after the other , then twice weekly then once then once a month untile none , then finished. Some patients may need more like activation injection once a year or twice or may be not at all

The last kids that he treated where from Bahrain and they were three brothers who were major , they transfuse every 20 to 25 days and after their treatment, their Hb stablized at 9,5  and 8 and 7.5. They had never transfused for the last 5years except one of them made BT once due to an accident.

I asked him since what i hear is a miracle to me, why is this not worldwide known. He answered that this has to do with politics as the majority of the world economy goes in weapons and drug manufacturing and countries like the US manipulates all this and won't let any homupathy companies emerge as their economy will get affected.He added that when he writes a medicne for some patient in Germany, the insurance pays but when he writes homuptic medicnes, the insurance doesn't pay.

I asked him about the Rodex and that i know it is also made from bone marroow of some animals so it has the same concept as his company. I told him that Kabir-love son didn't increase much on it just one or one and half grams which is too low. He answered that he knows the rodex and i shouldn't compare as there are different compositions with different ingriedents and each company has its own research. He said that sometimes differnt brands has different effect on the body though targeting the same disease.

When asked him when do i expect a change, he said that within  weeks mostly one month and when asked him should his HB increase one or two grams , he just said that he is supposed to have normal Hb for a child of his age meaning 11 or 12

I asked him when he can decide whether  to stop this treatment for my son or not. he just said usually this doesn'happen but if it did , he can say this after one month. He said that there is no allergies to this treatment as he gives the body exactly the normal cell componenet that it needs.

Injections could be given on daily basis or once per week but not a shot, you stay for 4 or 5 hours taking the solution as we do when we take glucose for example

I asked him to give me reference of the patients, he gave me the web site of the company and told me that they keep a refrence of patients and i can ask them

He said he can take any thing with this treatment except hydra as it contradicts with his treatment. His philosophy is that taking a medicne with side effectas to cure something,you will turn on later with a damage in the thing that you cured

I asked him directly, is this a trail medicine or in other words is what he is offering to may son is considered trails or he knows what he will e expecting, he assured me that there are no trails and this has been known for their company and they won't lose their name in the market ofter 50 years from being there

He said that these medicine will cost from 5000 to 6000 euros for the whole year.

He insisted on examining my son's iris as he said that it tells him if there are any hidden diseases or if the malfomation of blood is due to extra factors other than thal like liver malfuncting. So he can decide that he needs energy therapy with biomolecular therapy ot not

I am going to meet my hematologist and see whar she will say, but this doctors seems very confident and above all he understands thal quiet well

Hope i didn't for get any points and soooooooooo sorry for such a loooooooong post

Manal

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Offline §ãJ¡Ð ساجد

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Re: I am about to decide
« Reply #1 on: September 24, 2007, 05:45:18 AM »
Hi Manal,

I'd would really like to know what he is really doing rather than knowing that he is going to inject cells A B C D. This is something I have heard of for the first time.

All I know about the Stem cells of the bone-marrow is that it undergoes several stages to become the component cells (RBC, WBC and Platelet etc).

Probably this treatment involves the transfusion of intermediate form of the stem cell that are going to turn into RBC eventually. In other words, is he going to give a premature blood transfusion of these cell from another source whose stem cell looses the nucleus to decide to become an RBC? :huh

Will Ahmad get any antibodies from the animal of the source?
اَسّلامُ علیکم Peace be Upon you
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Kathy11

Re: I am about to decide
« Reply #2 on: September 24, 2007, 08:07:20 AM »
Hi Manal
I read through your post twice.I felt fear and desperation and uncertainty.
I know, if Ahmed was my son I would want to do whatever possible for him to have a better quality ,and a long life.
I have so many questions and reservations about what I have read and it petrified me,I dont know why?
Please find out all you can before you make the decission to put your son through the treatment.

May god Bless you with clarity and I hope you come to the right conclussion,be very carefull, he is precious   little boy
 :hugfriend :hugfriend
If possible talk to some of the doctors' previous patients.  to get a fair view of it all
 goodluck to you and your family
Much love Kathy

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Offline Zaini

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Re: I am about to decide
« Reply #3 on: September 24, 2007, 11:11:04 AM »
Hello Manal,

Quote
I read through your post twice.I felt fear and desperation and uncertainty.
I know, if Ahmed was my son I would want to do whatever possible for him to have a better quality ,and a long life.
I have so many questions and reservations about what I have read and it petrified me,I dont know why?

I agree with Kathy,i don't know why?please don't be dishearted or disappointed,but it's a big decision to make, and why you stopped thinking about retrodifferentiation?it seemed like a bit normal procedure as it is supposed to use body's own cells,not any foriegn elements,and i don't know but i don't much agree with his philosophy for not being known world wide ,anything that revolutionary must make the international news at least,govts can and do manipulate market,but what about the media,ther are free source,just take retrodifferentiation,i heard about it in Pakistan,you heard about it in Egypt,means it became known all around the world, anyways do some research and go ahead with what your heart tells you to do,

 :goodluck

ZAINI.
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Offline Manal

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Re: I am about to decide
« Reply #4 on: September 24, 2007, 12:59:26 PM »
Thanks all for your concern and replies, i know this is soo confusing

Sajid, he is injecting components of a living cell that is needed to form a correct stem cell in the human body.  So all the stages he is talking about are far beyond the stage of the stem cell. His target  is to make the body form a correct stem cell of its own. According to him no antibodies  will be formed because  no neucles is involved in this preocess

Kathy, I am praying that God shows me the right way and gives me clarity, this is really so tough. As you said i am emailing the company in Germany to get the patients contacts or any refrence, wish me luck

Zaini, i didn't stop thinking about retrodiff, but a week ago i emailed Dr. Ilham many of my questions and concerns about the process. I sent them on her personal email and on the tristem company mail. I received no answer and i guess that i won't receive any. The kind of questions i mailed her were od a kind that you have to have accurate answers which i don't think she has answers to them yet. I can not go through this process unless i have them answered. If you like, i can send them to you.
The coincendence is that when Dr. Ilham was in Egypt last May, she visited the center and discussed with them the procedure of taking her royality. The center postponed this until her trails are approved by other organizations.  I asked ( as if i don't know ) where her trails are done, the owner of the center said it is done in Pakistan and Jordan and when i said that i heard they are also done in London, he said that in london it is limited in research as the English government didn't approve this yet to be done there. So you can see it is pretty messy and unclear and till now i didn't receive any feedback from her.

Sometimes i say to myself that i tried chemotherapy ( which to me was a major step), so it is more easy for me now to try other things. What concerned me was that when i asked the opinion of this doctor about the effect of switching on gamma genes in the body and whether this could switch on any other unwanted things in the body (like carcenogenic genes or any of this sort ) , he replied that definetly this could happen. He added that there are 30 hormones in the human body who nobody knows any thing about them or how they are formed but definetly they are doing something so it is very confusing

I am really so stressed and there is nothing to do unless trying, i will be waiting for the opinion of my hema and see what she is going to say

Manal

Re: I am about to decide
« Reply #5 on: September 24, 2007, 02:56:20 PM »
Manal,

Thank you for sharing this information. I think you asked all the right questions and I think the best thing now is to talk to the patients and get their feedback. I am still researching this company and hope to find out more. Asking hems about alternative medicine is of course an important step, but it has never gotton me the answers I want to hear and  they are trained and accustomed to treating patients their way. Keep us informed. Thanks
Regards
Bharat 

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Offline Andy Battaglia

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Re: I am about to decide
« Reply #6 on: September 24, 2007, 03:59:15 PM »
Manal,

Let us know if you can get any actual patient results or testimonies. The Patients link on that site is no good and I can find very little online about this process other than what the company themselves say.
Andy

All we are saying is give thals a chance.

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Offline baal

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Re: I am about to decide
« Reply #7 on: September 24, 2007, 09:15:01 PM »
Hi Manal,

I am afraid that this "wonder doc" might not be serious nor his therapy...
Can we help somehow, maybe you can give us details of where he was working and having thal patients in Germany..
I never heard something like that... :(
Maybe we can find out more about him over here - just give us some more details, if you like on a personal message...

Believe me, it makes me angry and sad, when docs are playing with our parents emotions - just seeing to earn money...
I know about the fears and hopes of parents and relatives... I don't remember how many times me parents hoped due to wrong information of wonder docs for helling and miracles.

Take care,
Panos

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Kathy11

Re: I am about to decide
« Reply #8 on: September 24, 2007, 10:32:25 PM »
Dear Manal,
Remember stress is no good for you.You need to stay focus, If in doubt you have the choice  to refrain yourself,A sure bet
it is safe to stay with what you know has already make a difference in other  thals patients
 I care about you and Ahmed and I know you are a sensible person
and you will make the right choice for you and your family.
Love you     :wub :wub :wub :wub :wub :wub :wub
Kathy

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Offline Manal

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Re: I am about to decide
« Reply #9 on: September 25, 2007, 12:47:00 AM »
Bharat, thanks for your support, i will keep you updated

Andy, i have a relative who works in the pharmacology and lives in Germany, i gave him the the address of the company to see its reliability in this field and told him to phone them to ask about patient reference or sucess rates in similar cases

Panos, what you said is really what i need. Thank you sooooo much for your kind offer. I really appreciate it so much. I will PM you all the details tomorrow so i can have them all, but right now all i know is that he has been working for 12 years and still working as a researcher for the company (Vitorgan) that manufacture the medicne. The patients he treated were from Bahrain

Kathy, thank you for being there. i will investigate as much i can and hope that i can make a correct decision. You can not imagine how this doctor is so confident. When i told him that i accept the fact and it is okay for me that we are trying this treatment. He answered that he is not trying but he knows what he is doing and what is expected. So you cna see , hearing this as a mother makes me think million of times. Anyway i hope things get more clear in the coming days

All my love to you all

Manal

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Offline Sharmin

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Re: I am about to decide
« Reply #10 on: September 25, 2007, 03:13:51 AM »
Manal,

I know that you will do what is best for your adorable little boy.  Remember that there is so much on the horizon for thalassemia - you should not feel rushed to make any decisions.  I don't know if this treatment is valid or not - but make sure you have all of the facts you need before you make any decision.  I wish you all the best in making these decisions. 

Don't worry my friend, there will be a cure for our children soon. 

Sharmin
Sharmin

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Offline kabir_love

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Re: I am about to decide
« Reply #11 on: September 25, 2007, 09:44:56 AM »
hi manal,
 well though i dont know much about what is happeing.though my son is under rodex for now 9 months. and this is also from germany i hope the method must be quiet same its just that its being treatet by homeopath so its under suspecion always, well my some hb is 7.5 till now but what ever is it his growth is very normal and beside this no bt ever done and i m happy with this only.. apart he is a very happy child so i hope even this rodex buy we good time if not cure him but i hope till the time some one come up with 100% cure im really greatful to this doctor.

anyway i dont think that as your doct. said the hb will inrease in 1 month , as it will be 3 months atleast rest if you undergo the treatment then keep me updated aswell my email : hsimpex@rediffmail.com  ill recheck with my doc. as they both are using almost same kind of method. and as per my doc. now its 2 year teratment to stablize the hb. well for rest just pray to god to get the best of all here....

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Offline Zaini

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Re: I am about to decide
« Reply #12 on: September 25, 2007, 11:29:59 AM »
Hey Manal,

try to calm down and relax, i know it's a big decision,i am also a mother of a thal kid,so i know how hopes go up when we find something like this,and how fear clenches our heart for the unknown, but as Kathy said you need to be focused,the link for the patients on that side is not working,so it would do a lot of good if you can get some info about patients through your relative,though i think an important link like that should not be inactive,

Take deep breaths and calm down ,we are all here to support you. :hugfriend :bighug

ZAINI.
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Offline Manal

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Re: I am about to decide
« Reply #13 on: September 25, 2007, 11:34:12 AM »
Sharmin. Kabir-love and Zaini ,thank you sooo much for your support :hugfriend :hugfriend

Manal

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Offline maha

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Re: I am about to decide
« Reply #14 on: September 26, 2007, 11:58:48 AM »
Hi Manal
When I talked to the thal speciallist about the alternative medicines Hassan was taking, she told us over the years she had heard a lot of such claims. Infact when she was in Germany for a seminar she had met patients claiming to have been cured from thal. While there she tried to contact the doc responsible but he was not willing to talk to her. She also said she had heard such claims from Bahrain as well. Now I wonder if she was talking about the same therapy .
regards
maha

 

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