Gaza massacre

Andy
"Messed up is the polite words"

I am laughing so hard, thinking that it took you a while to work that out.
Thanks mate I  always have a good laugh reading some of your posting.Maybe it our Age :
Kathy

The word is MASSACRE!

Massacre, the deliberate and intentional killing of a large number of human beings, under circumstances of atrocity or cruelty, or contrary to "the usages established among civilized peoples" (International Humanitarian Law term from the Martens Clause).

I still can't believe that this word still exists these days!
This word shoud be replaced with LOVE, COMPROMISE, UNITY, CARING & so much more.

Lets focus at the substitute words from now on! 

Pray for the good of human kind! 

Andy,

And we are constantly afraid here for our neighbours the Turks, whom the USA love!.If anything happens we will be at the same situation like Palestinians.

Lena,

Actually you are the first Greek I speak who said that Greece is afraid for Turkey. Why is that? Could you explain the situation a bit more for me?

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I did my homework tomorrow and watched Al Jazeera. Al Arab??? had a too worse signal. I was still in pyjama's so I couldn't going outside to make the dish "snow-free".
They gave inside information of the biggest hospital of Gaza City. Unfortunately I was in the kitchen to prepare Ex. so I only saw the end. I also heard a professor from the American University of Beirut saying the truth, instead of the usa official from Fort at the end of the journal.

Edit: I saw the meeting of the EU as well. I hope they made me feel proud to be an European. They just changed the chairman; France gave the task to Czech Republic. Let me think, Czech took Sweden and France? with them to Egypt. I only heard the speech of the Swedish woman. I think I heard that Sarkozy 'goes for his own intention' to that area.

Dore

Dore,

Thanks for asking.
-The Turks constantly violate our national air-space with their aircraft. It happens so often. They fly their aircraft in our national territory, above our islands and make Greek aircraft fly to drive them away.
-They long for some Greek islands to be Turkish and they try their best for that, using much of a propaganda in that direction.
-They want the northeastern part of Greece for themselves.

As far as I remember myself, from a little girl, that fear is spread above Greece.We are constantly anxious that some day a war will emerge with the Turks,especially over the Aegean Sea.
Their governments are hostile and very provocative, no matter which party they come from.Our governments on the other hand, have so many times withdrawn not to create tension.
Lately, there is so much rumour about future extracting oil from our Aegean Sea and this causes much more fear and anxiety for us.
I hope logic will prevail and our countries will live in peace for many years to come.

Lena.

 

Lena,

I can totally understand your fears,as we have faced the same situation many times,I think i can safely say that people of Pakistan and India are not in favor of war,they have enough on their plates already,but our govts keep threatning,forces on the borders ,and media keeps misguiding.

Zaini.

Off-topic

Hi,

I got a question for the muslims. I was looking at the daily pictures of bbc world news (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/in_pictures/7813401.stm) The subcription of photo 4 talks about the month 'Muharram'. Is it true that it is this month 'Muharram'. I read the article at wikipedia and it says that you can't use voilence in this month. Is this it coincidence that we got this war now?
Why does this religious year always change from date? My knowledge about the Islam is nil. I sometimes think that people from the East (and Muslims)  know more about Christianity than people from the West (Christians) about Islam. I think we may even say that Muslims do know more about Christianity than not-religious people from the West. (I started to feel confused by meself. It's not my intention to hurt anyone by saying this. I partly talk about myself it's a long story. (As new year resolution I started to teach myself))

I got also a question about Arabic: What means beit? I saw that a few cities has beit in their names, like Beit Hanoun

Thank you for your explanation Lena. I will ask my Greek friend about this. They talk a lot about the situation in Greece, since the death of that young boy. Are there more islands than Cyprus who have this Greece/Turkey frontier issue?

Zaini, my "email-friend" talks a lot about the situation between Pakistan and India (and the situation in India). It makes her feel tired too and hopes that the situation will not escalate.

Dore

Dore ,
you asked a few questions here are the answer ...

1) I got also a question about Arabic: What means beit? I saw that a few cities has beit in their names, like Beit Hanoun ??..

Answer : Beit is an Arabic word and it mean's " house of " ..

2) I read the article at wikipedia and it says that you can't use voilence in this month. Is this it coincidence that we got this war now?

islam prohibite's to kill innocent people throughout the year, and  Yeah, is true ( as i heard ) ..

It is one of the four months of the islamic year in which fighting is prohibited. ...

but some people without the wealth of the knowledge of islam they fight and kill's each other .... they r far away to the teachings of islam , that is the main reason of violence,that they people make in this holy month ...

3) Why does this religious year always change from date?

answer : there is almost 10-12 days difference in between islamic and christian calendar ,( islamic calendar is short than christian calendar ... i think christian calender 365 day and according to this islamic has 353 ) .. islamic calendar is based on moon,, w months start's with moon ,, thats why we sight's the moon to start new month ....

i hope i answer the question ... Zaini and Manal Sis , please correct me if i said something wrong ..

Umair

Hi Dore,

Umair got it right,in the month of Moharram,fighting or waging war is prohibited,but what's going on in Gaza ,i believe is not waging war,but defending them selves on a very small scale.As you can see here,

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7812547.stm
 
You can learn a lot about islam by reading translation of Holy Quran,which is available in english,and i believe it must be available in dutch too.Check this,

http://quran.al-islam.com/Targama/DispTargam.asp?nType=1&nSeg=0&l=eng&nSora=1&nAya=1&t=ger

Muslims might know a little about christanity because we respect Jesus Christ (or Hazrat Essa,as we call Him here) as a very beloved Prophet of Allah (God).

Yes ,according to my knowledge of Arabic,Beit means home or house.

Situation between India and Pakistan is a bit tense always,but we have fought two wars and i don't believe that any side got anything from these wars.

Zaini.

Dore,

Cyprus is not a Greek island. Its inhabitants have Greek origin, yes, they are Greek-Cypriots but the island of Cyprus is a totally different nation.
I was referring to the Greek islands of the Aegean Sea, the ones that are so favourite touristic destinations for the whole world.I do not know if you have visited them:let's say Myconos, Naxos, Paros, Santorini,Crete and so many others.You will see them if you get a map of Greece. They lie between Greece and Turkey in the Aegean Sea.They are many.many beautiful small islands which are so preferred by so many tourists around the world.I was talking about them, especially the ones that lie near the Turkish coasts.All of them are Greek, but the Turks wish they were theirs.Of course they will never be.

Lena.

Lena,

That was really dumb of me!  Ofcourse I know Cyprus is not Greek. I know lots of people who have visit Crete or other big islands, but I have never visit Greek by myself. I love geograpic so I will definitely search for the islands you have mention in the atlas.

Thank you Umair and Zaini. So beit Hanoun is the home of Hanoun. Hanoun must have been a rich family of that area?
They use that video during the journal, but he close with the words 'this was  for the Dutch tv'.

There's one Dutch site which publice text of the Bible and Quran side by side (chapter 1 and 1 or themes) so that you can compare them. The site is available in NE and EN www.bijbelenkoran.nl.

Well, I should buy this in book form, because my eyes are starting to dislike the screen 

On topic:

It's more than a shame that they are attacking schools of the UN. I really had tears in my eyes when we were watching the journal. I really have no words for this. And then the Israelers were talking about a third stage

Hi Dore

*As for the picture you saw, it shows some celebrations of Shiaa who are also muslims but a different sector ( can't find the correct translation, but it is like in christinanity there are catholic, orthodox, protestant ...sorry for the spelling) Muslim sunni and Shiaa have almost everything in common except for one or two things, but sunni don't agree at all with the extremist shiaa as they differ in the belief itself and unfortunatly they are more seen in the media) This introduction to tell you that i can not comment on the picture since i am not shiaa

*answering your question about the holy months or sacred months. These months did not start by the begining of islam but they were known by at the time of prophet Ibrahim (Abrahm) and Arabs used to stop fighting during these months. When islam came , it contiued the same way and these months are Zul qada, Zul hegga, Muharam and Ragab. The first month was because it is the month right before pilgrimage and so you don't have to fight but rather prepare for the pilgrimage. The second month is the month of pilgrimage itself and the third month is the one that follows the pilgrimage. The fourth month which is ragab meaning the ''great''. Tribes in the past used to change the months to go with their own benefits as sometimes they want to raid in these months. This was stopped until Quran stated the exact  names of these months as i mentioned them earlier. In those months you are not allowed to fight but you can defeat your self if someone fought you (self defense). In those months you are highly rewarded for your good deeds and vice versa.

* As for the site comparing the bible and the quran, i don't think it is a good idea as there is no point of compariosn they are totally different, that is my opinion, though i didn't understand anythin in dutch

* As for muslims knowing about christianity, that is because you can not be a true muslim unless you believe in all prophets of God Jesues for christianity and Moses for the Jews, so we got to know the history, that is all


Will be happy to answer any thing that is not clear

manal

Dore,

According to wikipedia:
 

According to local legend, Beit Hanoun was the capital of the Philistine King Hanoun who fought the Assyrians in the 8th century BCE.

So it appears that city got its name from the then King Hanoun

Hallo,
I agree that the site is pretty strange. If you ask me it's made for some stupity (or racist) politicians/inhabitants of my country. I feel very ashamed for them.

Your spelling was ok, but I think we should name the Evangelicals (they are different than other protestants) as well.I live in the "Biblebelt" and the Orthodox and Evang. are pretty huge here.

@ Dutch and English has similar (and meaning) words like: warm and hand. But also the same words with different meaning, which i mess up from time to time.

I think I got the most chance to find a book form in Amsterdam, but i won't visit the city centre before friday 16th.

@ Tariq: I probably read not far enough at wiki  

Groetjes, Dore

Hi Dore ,
pwhen you're going to buy Quran to read please make sure that is true Quran ... bcoze i heard that people and the lobies made several fake Qura' for propgenda purpose like one of those i know as Noble Quran and etc..etc...... soo please make sure that you are buying true one to keep ur mind safe from propogenda abt islam and its peaceful teaching ... if ou want to learn abt it you can contact to any mosque in your area , or in UK there are several mosques, organizations Pakistani's and Indian muslim communities that my help you alot to finding right books of islam especialy Quran Majeed ....

Best Regards
Take Care
Umair

Looks like everyone on this group is completely agreed about the bestiality of Israel.

Well, I am on the other side. I think Gaza had it coming.

1. Hamas illegally seized power in Gaza from Fatah, through the use of force - they are *not* the democratically elected government. Israel does not want to deal with Hamas, as Hamas' manifesto calls for the destruction of Israel. Surely, you would not want to deal with those who want to wipe you out? Are you not entitled to put a blockade on a set of people who threaten to destroy you? The moot question here is why does Egypt enforce the SAME blockade? Please answer me that.

2. Hamas has been sending rockets into Israel for the past ONE year - recently, they acquired the capability to hit more cities in Israel by smuggling in longer range missles from Iran. So, the threat to Israel went up.

3. Israel has called for Hamas not to attack it for the past one year. They have asked the people of Gaza to restrain Hamas. Do you not think that ONE year of warnings as enough?

Sure, Israel has attacked with overwhelming and disproportionate force - but, blame the Hamas for this action. They invited the attack. Is it any surprise that even the Arab nations are not in full support of Hamas?

I live in Mumbai where cowardly terrorists have killed over 375 people in two attacks between 2006-08. I am completely in agreement with Israel's policy - no one shall attack us continuously and get away with it.

RE: Oil and leverage - I have news for you folks - the Arab nations with oil have ZERO leverage left. I was in Oman in the last week of December on holiday, and in various GCC countries in the previous six months on business. The lifestyle of the locals (not just the sheiks) have to be seen to be believed - the local subsidies all run on oil revenues. There is no other industry, no other economy in the region. Even Dubai is now crashing and burning - their real estate is down 50% from the peak in Aug. So, you do not sell your oil, you do not have any money - you do not have any money, the locals will starve - if the locals starve, you have a revolution.

There is no way, repeat no way, that the GCC will EVER use oil as leverage.

RE: Pakistan - Zaini, I truly feel sorry for your country. Your country had some of the most fertile land of the Indus basin, rich cities, terrific culture, educated people. Your folks wanted a separate nation-state and you got it. However, in 60 years, your politicians, mullahs and army have virtually destroyed your nation. I am sorry to say this but balkanisation of your nation is inevitable - India does not even have to do anything, we will just watch, in pain. The path of hatred towards India that your army and your mullahs chose has brought the most educated muslim nation to this juncture. I truly feel sorry for Pakistan - it could have been a shining symbol of muslim pride, now it is a failed state.

Poirot